Lightly edited for readability while preserving the speaker’s meaning and substantive statements.
Lord, that's our prayer right now that we pray you will send your glory. Lord, your presence, your power, your anointing among your people. Lord, that's what we need.
We need your anointing. We need your presence. We need your glory. We need your strength. Or we need the power to be witnesses. We need you to confirm your word with signs following. We pray for the anointing on the preaching or what we do here. What our students will do in their evangelism. Lord, everything that we do, Lord, we pray for the anointing of your spirit, the leading of your spirit and the power of your Holy Spirit. And we pray this right now in the name of Jesus. Amen. Amen. Hallelujah. You may be seen this morning. We welcome everyone to Fire and Grace Church. Got a lot of people out today sick or traveling. Yes. OK, Sandra says she has a word to share. The Lord says I am the same yesterday, today and forevermore, and I will never leave you. I'll always be with you. So to seek me while you can. And that if you can't find me, I'm in my word. My word is me. Amen. Amen. Receive that. Amen. Everybody take your Bibles out and turn with me to Psalm 133. Didn't plan on starting with this, but that last song just kind of motivated me here because we talk about the anointing of the Holy Spirit, the power of the Holy Spirit, a lot of the need for that in our lives, in our church. You know, let me just say this. I think most people know after our church has been here, now we're going on 16 years, got a little bit of a track record, right? I've been doing this now for 37 years, got a little bit of a track record. OK, I think people know that when it comes to church, and I hear this from people all over the country, different parts of the world, they say, you know, your church is like the church is supposed to be in a sense. You're at least what you preach and teach. A lot of people don't get to attend here, so they don't know what it's like to actually be here week to week. A lot of people are really shocked when they find out how small our church is that had been watching out there because, you know, we'll have eight to ten thousand people watch the sermon every week. And so they just think, you know, it's a big church. No, we're not a big church. And there's a reason why we're not a big church, because the battles that this church faces to do what we do, to preach what I preach, to teach what I teach,
is the battle like I cannot even put into words to try to maintain unity, order, respect of authority. We can talk about that a little bit today. To do things biblically. You know, I saw a meme on Facebook this morning. I've been up since about 1 30, but I saw a meme and it was like, what that goofy guy from the office mean? Well, you know, one of those. But it said there that biblical Christianity is unpopular, and popular Christianity is unbiblical. And I was like, yep, bingo. See, what's really unpopular, and it's unpopular with a lot of Christians, is when you get down into the nitty gritty of the Bible, what the Bible says about things that most of us want to avoid. We want to avoid, or that we've been to so many churches in America that are so watered down, and we got accustomed to that. So then you come to a church like this and start hearing stuff that you didn't hear for years and years and years, or in a way you've never heard it. It really kind of shocks the spiritual system. But that's okay, because our battle, our battle is to be a biblical church, okay? And that means sound doctrine from Genesis to Revelation on things. Now, I know there are people out there that hate my guts, and they go to different denominations and things. I'm talking about Christians who cannot stand me because they are into false doctrines, whatever it may be. It always saved Calvinism, pre-Trib rapture beliefs, Preterism, I mean, there's all kinds of errors out there that I deal with. But I think most people know, and most people who have followed me or followed the ministry for a long time now, know that doctrinally, if I'm going to make a point, I'm going to kind of cover it thoroughly, whatever it may be. Creation, deliverance, spiritual warfare, healing, miracles, and try to give the balanced side of those things. I don't think anybody can really charge me with false doctrine, teaching false doctrine, and be correct in that accusation, all right? So that's the first thing. Second thing is, there's no one that can charge me with immorality, because I'm not living it. And there's no one that can charge me with misuse of funds, because I live in a 100-year-old house that keeps needing repairs, and I drive a 12-year-old truck. So I'm not getting rich off of doing this, all right?
So I'm not misusing money. So when it comes to that, then here's the thing, and this is what we've got to remember. And this we need to remember not just about leadership but about each other. Be very careful when you decide to criticize or attack, because a lot of times, these things are like minor issues that if you let continue, they're going to blow up into big issues. And I'm going to explain what I'm talking about. But let's read this. This is Psalm 133. We want the anointing. We want the glory of God. We want the power of the Holy Spirit to move. And this is one of the songs of David here. And he said, behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity. It is like the precious ointment upon the head that ran down upon the beard, even Aaron's beard, and went down to the skirts of his garments, as the dew of Herman and as the dew that descended upon the mountains of Zion, for there the Lord commanded the blessing, even life forevermore. So in the context of talking about unity, how wonderful he is for brethren to dwell together in unity, he says that is part of what brings the anointing and the outpouring of the Holy Spirit. But notice he could have just said, I just pour my spirit out if you're in unity. No. He actually said it's like the anointing that came upon Aaron. Why did he bring up Aaron? Because Aaron was one of his delegated authorities. Moses was a delegated authority. Aaron was a delegated authority. And he's letting us know that the anointing comes down from the Lord. Because today's really a message about leadership. Then upon his leadership, delegated authority. And then to what? Down to the rest of the body. Because Aaron also represents the high priest. Jesus is the high priest, so it represents his body. Now, there's misnomers about unity in the body of Christ. Because there's a lot of people that think that unity means that we can disagree about a bunch of stuff and be in unity. That's not a definition of unity. Let me just give you that. That's a little tidbit of wisdom, right? In fact, in Amos 3.3, let's put that up. God asked Israel this when Israel was in, they had their idolatry going on, all their compromise and issues. And the prophet Amos, God speaking through him, says, this, can two walk together except they be agreed? What is the obvious answer to that question? No. Now, let's go to 1 Corinthians chapter 1, verse 10.
This is one of those things that I've been preaching for a long time that's not popular. Because let me just go and tell you, there's a phrase that I hate more than any, I think. It's in the top five of phrases that I hate. Let's just agree to disagree. I'm about sick of hearing that. Because that basically says, you know what? I don't care what the Bible's in. This is, too, when you're talking about, here's what scripture says. I don't really care about that. I don't agree with that. You're not disagreeing with me if I'm telling you what the Bible says about something, right? Now, here's what the apostle Paul said would deal with division. He says, now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that you all speak the same thing. Somebody said, somebody say this with me. Speak the same thing. That there be no divisions among you, that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. For it hath been declared unto me, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you. Now, I love that the house of Chloe was tattletales. But God seems to be okay with that. And guess what? I get tattletales too. People come to me and they just tattle. And it's good because if there's a problem going on, I need to know about it. Sometimes I find out way too late that there's been a problem and nobody told me and it would have been better had they told me sooner so I could deal with the problem sooner, all right? But here this, now granted, will we ever have perfect unity in a church? No. But is that not the Bible, the goal of what the Bible says? The goal is to speak the same things, have the same mind, have the same judgment, okay? That is vitally important. Now, this is why church-wise, you know, we have a statement of faith where we put out what we believe from the scriptures on the fundamental doctrines of Christianity. From the Bible being the infallible, inspired word of God, to Jesus being God in the flesh, to the triune nature of God, AKA the Trinity, to the baptism, the Holy Spirit, evidence of speaking in other tongues. I mean, we'll get down to the list. Repentance, baptism. I mean, we put it all out there. Salvation through Jesus alone, through faith in his blood, his death on the cross, his resurrection, that's the way you are saved. Turning from sin, becoming a disciple. I mean, we put it all out there, okay?
And, you know, I don't give you 20-minute sermonettes for Christianettes, right? I try to give you the word, try to go through it systematically, all right? Now, again, our goal should be, if we're part of a church, to the best of our ability. If we can't agree with the foundational doctrines, then guess what? You shouldn't be here. And the part two of that, too, if you can't handle spiritual authority and actually submitting to leadership, and if you can't submit to the leadership of the church, then you shouldn't be in it. You hear me? This is just the way it is. And one of two things is gonna happen is that either you're going to submit to the doctrinal positions of the church, the leadership of the church, and to those two things, to the authority of the authorities within the church, or you're going to rebel. Now, if you rebel, that means you start, usually rebellion starts with the mouth, talking, all right? And then, of course, it goes from that to actually more talking and more spreading around, and then it just gets poison, okay? It just becomes poison. Now, I just had to deal with something this week. It's no, most of you, everybody knows, I think we sent out the text about it. I tried to give as little information as possible in dealing with that situation because I'm not trying to hurt anybody, and I'm not trying to put everybody's stuff out there. But as I dealt with this person, this particular family that I told, it was time for them to move on from our church, I'm finding out more and more situations where I had strictly told her because she came here with a bunch of new age, divination, alternative healing techniques, and ideas, and things of that nature, which I told her from the beginning, if you come here and try to teach that, there's going to be a problem. And I actually told them not to move here, and actually told her the first time we had dinner together that I sent the spirit of witchcraft on her. Now, I'm not saying she's a Satan worshiper, but when you're into new age, divination, techniques, different alternative healing techniques and things of that nature, you have opened the door to demons and it's a spirit of witchcraft there. The spirit's a divination there, okay? Now, honestly, I'm gonna be honest with you, I was probably far too patient because what I found out was this person was going behind my back and laying hands on people and praying for people and trying to help people
with her alternative medical practices and techniques and would say sometimes to the people, I know Pastor Dean doesn't want me doing this, but now I'm gonna tell you what that is. I don't care how you slice it, dice it, don't like it. That is rebellion. It is rebellion to the spiritual authority and to the doctrinal positions of this church on those type of things. And what does the Bible say? Rebellion is as what? Spirit of witchcraft. And there are people literally that because she was into that stuff and would never truly let go of it, I'm gonna tell some of you that went and had your blood divination test or hands laid on you or you let them pray for you or even ate food that came from there. We've already had serious, massive deliverance over that person laying hands on people. It happened at Skyfall and under strict, Skyfall, we have very strict policy. No one lays hands on anybody, no one prays for anybody unless they have the prayer team badge and we change the color of it every year and this past year it was orange. And if you didn't have that orange badge, I don't care if you're a member of Fire and Grace Church, if you don't have that orange badge on you, you don't lay hands on anybody, you don't pray for anybody because we're trying to protect people from people that slip in and witches that slip in and people that we don't know, all right? And so the person that I had to deal with this week, right before Cheetra got up to speak at Skyfall last year, went over and said, I know Pastor Dean, I know I'm not supposed to do this, but lay your hands on her and pray for her anyway. And Cheetra said, when she prayed over that, I'm gonna let her share in a minute what happened when she went through deliverance. But here's my point, and let me say this too before I get into this any deeper, just because somebody comes here and I let somebody come here for a while, does not mean I trust them or you should trust them. You need to discern the situation for yourself. You need to be careful about who you let lay hands on you. All right? And tell you the truth, I'm gonna be honest, sometimes because I have had to deal with this crap, this kind of crap, really for 37 years, I am tired of it, but it's part of the job. It's kind of like how some people don't like taking out the trash, some people don't like
doing the dishes. I am absolutely worn out and weary with it. But I know it's gonna happen again, all right? So I'm saying all that to say that it's important for you to understand this spirit of rebellion, because I know there's a lot of churches. America, America is, we were founded upon a rebellion, right? I believe justified because England and King George, they were tyrants and they were massacring people and just killing people and just doing whatever they wanted to do. And I believe there's a point where you do stand up against evil leadership. The evil, like when the government mandates the mark of the beast, we're to stand up and resist that, we're not to submit. But other than that, other than that, we are supposed to be people who understand spiritual authority, whether it be in the church, in school, in government, family. We're supposed to understand spiritual authority, respect it and obey it or else we will find ourselves in rebellion and once we enter that rebellion, a spirit of witchcraft comes upon us and we can be deceived in all kind of different manners. All right, now we're gonna put up, Kelsey, go ahead and put up, I'm pulling out, this is the leadership class in the School of Ministry, this is actually class number one in the leadership class that, this one's not even public, I don't think, but this is not, again, this is not that I haven't taught on this stuff before, but I want you to, I wanna go through some of this because the slides are already here. But let's look at this, we're gonna go to the next slide. Now here's what leadership means, the action of leading a group of people or organization, the state or position of being a leader, a leader is supposed to what? You have guidance, direction, authority, control, management, supervision, so on down the line. A lot of people don't like the word control, always controlling if you have leadership, no. There's a measure of, always a measure of control within leadership, that's the whole point of having it, right? I don't care if you're the father of the house, there is some control, like, you're not gonna do certain things in my house, oh, he's controlling, well, I'm sorry, you're not smoking marijuana and you're not having sex with, you know, fornication in my house, right? Oh, that's mean, that's control, well, I'm sorry, that's just the way it is. Leadership has to deal with those kind of issues and say, this is the limits and this is where it's gonna stop and I know some people have a hard time with me,
just dealing with me because I am not a little pushover, I'm not a little Ahab leader, never have been, never will be, I am going to be a real leader and a real leader, there will be a level of, this is the line and we're not going there and this is just what it has to be and the other side of that, just like a father has to protect his house and, you know, the teachers and the administration have to protect the school and so on down the line, there are things I have to do to protect the rest of you that aren't pleasant sometimes. I have to deal with people who will not change their ways and they start spreading it. I'm gonna tell you right now, rebellion to authority is a little cancer that kind of spreads and it's sown like a little and it causes strife and it causes division and everything else. We'll go to the next one here. So let's look at this, this is 1 Corinthians 12, 28 and then Ephesians 4, 11, everybody ought to know this but God's church has ordered to it the true church. Now I know, look, I thought about this, I was thinking about this the last couple of days and I was thinking about how there's a lot of things that call themselves churches out there. I would like to call some of them, not really churches but gatherings of Christians, fellowships, right? They're just basically Christians getting together instead of the church being what the church is supposed to be, right? And that's why, look, we've had in the world, the church of Jesus Christ has been so subpar, we have been so anemic and so weak that when you dare try to do things the way the book says, people think you are strange, controlling, you're a cult. I mean, we've been called all kinds of names simply because we try to follow what this is and let me just tell you what the book says. The church of Jesus Christ has never been a democracy. It's not a democracy. Now, America's not a democracy for that point but the church is not a democracy. It's not majority rule. It's not, y'all vote. Now, there are churches like that that their church government, Presbyterians, some Baptists, whatever, they vote and they can vote the pastor right out the door, right, and they do it all the time or they have a demon board, I mean deacon board and a lot of them are Freemasons
and adulterers and everything else and they let them rule the church because they got a lot of money and what happens? Pastor starts talking about some of that stuff they don't wanna hear and they take a vote and he's out the door, right? That is never how the church is supposed to be and that's why this church is not that but then folks, because we're not that, because you don't get to vote the pastor out, you're controlling, you're a cult, you're this and it's amazing in this world that if anybody is actually a true leader, a strong leader, you're a cult leader all of a sudden, right? No matter how many times I tell y'all, you got, you are free to vote with your feet. You don't have to be here. I don't, have I been to anybody's house with a gun to your head saying you must come to Fire and Grace Church? No, I have people trying to move here from other states that they don't do it, not the move of a cult leader. I want you to pray fast, hear from the Holy Spirit, okay? That's what I want for your life. I don't wanna control your life. I don't wanna know all the minutia of your life. I really don't, I've got enough of my own, right? But if I'm gonna try to do this the way God said to do it in his word, then this is it right here. He says God has set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healing, helps governments, diversities of tongues. Now when he says he set some of the church first, that means in rank, position, all right? Now granted, most of the church world has no concept of the five-fold ministry. Apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers, they have no concept, no understanding of it because they were never taught it. They went to churches and the only really thing they ever heard of was either a pastor, maybe they heard of an evangelist, and then maybe they acknowledged somebody has a teaching gift. Usually though, they leave out the whole thing, apostles and prophets. But here's what Ephesians four says, and he gave some, speaking of Jesus, giving gifts to the church. Somebody say, pastor, Dean's a gift. He gave some apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, some pastors and teachers for the perfecting or the maturing of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying or building up of the body of Christ till we all come into this, what? Oh, my job is to get everybody into this, to grow up, to mature, to get into what? Unity, what is biblical unity? We all speak the same thing, have the same mind and judgment, right? We can't walk together unless we're agreed. We can't be, so, but this is the job
of the five-fold ministry. And then he says, till we all come into the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God unto a perfect or mature Christian, unto the measure, the stature, the fullness of Christ. Why? Lowness, it's a colon here. He says, that we henceforth be no more children tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine by the slight of men in cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive, meaning the people that slip in to teach you other things, to lay hands on you, to blah, blah, blah, whatever it may be. But this right here, I know that there's other churches in the world, they don't understand this, they don't operate this way, but we do. All right? And I love, one of my old pastors back in the day used to say this, he said, I make people nervous because they didn't hire me and they can't fire me. Right? And what is that? What is that right there? When you didn't hire me and you can't fire me, then guess what? That means I'm free to say whatever I need to say. I'm free to teach whatever I need to teach without the threat of being fired. Oh, and I've been fired before from a church that had that kind of government. They fired me. Why? Because I confronted their problems. You're fired. Best thing that ever happened to me, thank you. I get to leave Washington DC and go back to Alabama. That was a great day in America right there. All right? Now, this right here is the war. I almost wore my tactical vest today. It has my sheepdog patch on it. And I thought about bringing one of my ARs just as an illustration, but my wife said, that might be a little extreme. But you need to understand something about spiritual authority. The church, we've got to lose the mindset, okay? That the church is like a little social church. Counseling, family counseling meeting. That ain't it, okay? I've heard people say the church is a hospital. No, it's not. What the church is, is the military base. This is what, I've said this before, but I've got to get it in you. And that's why I've got this whole thing about, some of you are gonna have to toughen up a little bit because this is not, we're not a social club. Do you know that the church of Laodicea, when you look that word up, it means they were a church that was a social club, all right? We're not a social club, okay? Now, I love it when y'all love each other
and fellowship and talk and all that. That's all icing on the cake. It's not the cake, okay? Because we're a military operation and we are under attack, okay? And a military operation, any time you have military, you have leaders, you have officers, you have commanders, and it's broken down. And let me tell you what, in the midst of battle, there's no arguing. There's no arguing with your superior, Air Force, right here, right? What would happen if you argue with an order? Ooh, yeah, you don't get to, that's right. There's no arguing to be going on. There's orders and orders that you'd be obeyed. Got a quote from Sun Tzu here in a minute that's very interesting, but once we, if we would get it down in our minds that we are a military operation here and that I need you doing your job, you think about it in a, whether it's a platoon, whether it's a battalion or a division or a company, whatever size, if they, everyone does not do their job and stay in their rank, which means that they purposefully stay in unity, how do they stay in unity? They stay in unity by not lifting themselves up into something they're not and they, by following orders. And if we don't do that, guess what happens? We're not in unity. I wanna show you something. This is, I think that's 1 Corinthians, I'm not 1 Corinthians, but 1 Chronicles 12. I wanna go back to that. Yeah, I did a lot of reading between two o'clock this morning and, and I'm not gonna read all of this. You can read the entire chapter 12, but this is after Saul has died and the nation is starting to come together to make David the king. And he already had mighty men, but then the people began to come to him from all over. Now he was, you know, when David first became king, he did not become king over all of Israel like he was supposed to be. He was king only in Hebron for a while. There was still a little rebellion and still some Saul followers. And they kind of held onto part of the country. So it was kind of divided for a while, for seven years. And then the country was fully unified under David. But this was the beginning of the children of Israel from all different tribes, even some from the tribe of Benjamin came.
And what's interesting, you go over, I wanna read this, go down to verse, we'll just go down to verse 32, because I'm not gonna read the whole thing. That's your homework. You can go read the whole chapter. He says, of the children of Issachar, which were men that had understanding of the times, to know what Israel ought to do, the heads of them were 200 and all their brethren were at their commandment. Of Zebulun, such as went forth to battle expert in war with all instruments of war, 50,000, which could keep rank. Somebody say which could keep rank and were not of double heart. Do you see that? It kind of repeats this. If you go down to verse 38, after he talks about all these, he says, all these men of war that could keep rank came with a perfect heart to Hebron to make David king over all Israel. And all the rest also of Israel were of one heart to make David king. Now, I was reading that and I thought, keep in rank. What does that mean? Keep in rank means knowing exactly who you are and where you are and what you're supposed to be doing. If you're not the pastor, do not worry about my job. I'm gonna do my job. May do it in ways you don't like. I don't care. It's not your job. It's my job. It's my responsibility. Now, because God called me to do this when I was 19, appeared to me in a vision, called me to the ministry, to the fivefold ministry, confirmed that through other apostles and prophets that have faithful ministries of 50 and 60 years. I'm not somebody that called myself into this. I'm not somebody that decided to go to seminary and this would be kind of a good job to have. See, I'm one of those guys that God sent, okay? So God gave me the authority that I have. God gave me the position that I have. He gave me the gifts and the anointing that I have, the abilities that I have. So what I'm saying is that I know what I'm doing and after 37 years, I can just go ahead and tell you right now, in this spiritual warfare that we're in, I am an expert in war. And there are things about spiritual warfare, we don't have every little detail written in here, in the book. There's things that you just have to go through and find out by experience sometimes, all right? So let me say this, when I say something about a certain situation, trust me about one thing, that either I know what's in here or I have seen it with my own eyes multiple times
in the midst of battle. I have dealt with witches at every level, Satanists at every level, New Agers at every level, demon-possessed people at every level, infiltrators of every kind, from Jesuits to government agents, to Satanists, to witches, to New Agers, to multiple pronged attacks coming at the church at multiple times. CIA operatives releasing COVID on me to kill me and say, oh, Pastor, are you crazy? Oh, no, no, no. See, because I walk sometimes in the word of knowledge when I walk up to somebody, if God wants me to know everything about you, I can walk up to you, shake your hand, and the Lord showed me a movie of your life and what you're doing. Now, I don't control that, but when he does it, I know, and I don't have to explain it to you. I don't have to apologize for it. I don't have to soften the blows. I just deal with the problem. Because let me just go in and tell you that this war that we're in, it's not just spiritual, because it ends up affecting your life. I mean, it can be life and death. It can be sickness and health. It can be your kid getting saved or your kid going off and committing suicide. It's that type of war we're dealing with. So I'm not gonna apologize that I take this pretty seriously. So I've told people, it's like, when I say stuff, I'm not just wasting my breath, right? When I say, don't lay hands on people at Skyfall, you best not be laying hands on people. Because I'm not joking about this. Because there's purpose behind all of these things. We had a situation a few years ago when the ministry school first started, and there was a person that started causing problems within the school of ministry, because the first class, we had some students here and started causing problems. And I told the guy, I said, he just wanted to keep arguing about a certain incident that happened. And I said, not another word about it, or you're gone. And I said, do you understand what I'm saying? I don't wanna hear a peep, nothing. And I better not find out that you went and talked to anybody else about it. It's over, or you are walking back to Texas, son. Guess what he did?
Left that phone conversation, came up here to the church, and Kevin was here, and ran his mouth for an hour to Kevin. Of course, Kevin was like the house of Cloy and told me. And guess what? Texas boy went back to Texas. Oh, and he turned on me and makes videos against me and everything else, but guess what? I don't care. Rebellion was in his heart, and he thought he was the expert on deliverance, and he hadn't even been right with God the full year or so. Just let go of the marijuana pipe not too long ago. I mean, he told me. And I'm sitting here going, stop with this nonsense. But it actually also, because he kept running his mouth, it caused division, and it caused problems. But see, if we understood authority, spiritual authority, then we wouldn't enter these situations. It would be, and this is one of the problems, and I want to say before we go any further on this, our students are required to read a book, and if you haven't read it, I encourage you to get it. You can actually find a free PDF out there. I mean, it's been around so long, but it's called Spiritual Authority by Watchman Nee, the Chinese apostle. I actually spent most of the early morning hours rereading the book today, because it's that vitally important. It's the one class that you cannot go any further in our school, you must take it. And vitally important book. The teaching that he did on the subject of authority throughout the scriptures is really unparalleled. It's just, you don't need to rewrite this book right here. Well, I'm saying, it was that well done. Now, let's go to a quote from him. I think it's right after this. This is from the book here. He says, God sets in the church authority such as the elders who rule well, those who labor in preaching and teaching, they are the ones whom everyone should obey. The younger ones in age must also learn to be subject to the older ones. The apostle exhorted the Corinthian believers to honor especially men like Stephanists, Stephanosists or whatever, whose family was the first converts in a cave. Why did he say the first? Why did he say honor them? Why did he say, listen to them? Because they were the what? The elders, the first ones that came in. I cannot stress to you how important it is to find true, godly elders
that you can submit to and actually obey because if you don't, if you don't, because there's a lot of Lone Ranger cowboys out here and cowgirls and I understand, look, I understand the problem out there that there's not a lot of churches anymore that are trying to do it biblically. So I understand it's hard to find sometimes, but let me tell you, it was kind of hard for me for a while when I was a young man to find elders that I could fully trust. And when I did though, it's been good because even though me and like, let's just say Gene May, everybody knows Gene May was a true apostle and prophet in my life early on. And that we have had times where we don't talk to each other for a long time, not because we're ill or anything, it was just going about our lives, but then there's times we talk about things. But over the years, I've been able to get his counsel on things and we had him at Skyfall 2020. I mean, he's getting up in age now. But, and he and I don't agree on everything, okay? Every little detail, the big things we do. And you know what? I have never not one time tried to argue with him over something that I disagree with him about. You know why? Because I respect him as an elder and as a spiritual authority. And let me just go in and tell you right now, it is not your job to voice your opinion about everything. I don't. Lord, y'all better be glad I don't. How many things I could say that I don't say, all right? But let me just go and tell you right now, you can be in a situation, listen to me, you can be in a situation and you can, you know, an elder or a pastor or an apostle or a prophet can say something that you don't exactly agree with or maybe you don't fully understand or maybe you hadn't studied it or you don't know or you think you know and you think you gotta say something right now. No, you don't. No, you don't. Unless it's some massive doctrinal error. And I made some people mad a few years ago when I said, your opinions don't matter. It's more about, let me tell you what it's more about. It's more about the attitude of your heart. Can it be quiet? Can it be humble? If you find yourself always having to voice your opinion on something, you got a pride issue. You got a self-control issue.
And as Christians, one of the things is that what, even if a fool keeps his mouth shut, he's considered wise, right? And this is what, look, Miriam and Aaron, what did they do? They decided, you know, God talks to us. And you know, Moses, he married that Ethiopian kushite woman. He, you know, what's he think he's doing? You know, we're more holy. We're just as holy as him. And the Lord said, hey, the Lord came in that said, hey, you three come out here for a minute, the woodshed time. And the Lord took him out and said, you know what, Miriam and Aaron, yeah, I speak to you and your dreams and your visions. He said, I speak to Moses face to face. And actually he said, Moses gets to see my form. And since y'all are not afraid to speak against Moses, smack leprosy upon you. And then Aaron, now the reason God didn't smite Aaron and only hit Miriam with it, it was not because God hates women, but Aaron was the high priest. And if God would have smitten him with leprosy, he would have been unclean and it would have disrupted everything. But it wasn't that the high priest couldn't drop dead, but God was having mercy. And so when Miriam gets hit with leprosy, they cry out, oh God, you know, because leprosy you just consume away until you die. Stuff starts rotting off, falling off until you die and there's no cure for it. And they were like, oh God, don't let this happen. He said, the Lord said, well, you know what, she's gonna have it for seven days and have to stay outside the camp. What was the big sin? All they did was open their mouth against God's delegated authority. It wasn't that Moses was perfect or sinless or anything. You're not gonna have a perfect leader, but if you got one that God has called and picked and appointed, you best be careful how you handle the situation. I'm telling you this for your own good because I'm fine. I will deal with you. I'll deal with you either in here or I'll send you out there. I'll deal with it. But if it stays in your heart, that rebellion, that attitude, that unsubmissiveness, that lack of humility to be able to say, I will obey. And let me just tell you right now, your submission to authority is not tested until you disagree. That's when it's tested. If you agree and everything's hunky-dory and you're fine with doing whatever, is that a test? No. It's when you're standing there going, I don't wanna do it. You know, we've had these issues arises like my wife and I'm just gonna say this again.
I know it's not popular in the world. I deal with it in the leadership section of the School of Ministry about women in ministry. The women being silent in the church is taken out of its context because it's about wives being submitted to their husbands. Not that women can't be ministers in the church and can't teach and preach because he said, you all may prophesy. One by one, well, that's women, right? We know there were women ministers, deacons, Phoebe, and so on down the line. But let me just go on and say this. My wife is not only because she's my wife, but God called her, she was saved, filled with the Holy Spirit at six years old. God raised her up in the ministry before we ever came together. So it's not just because she's my wife, but I wanna tell you right now, there's no one like Paul said about Timothy. Paul said, I got nobody that's like-minded, he said, except Timothy right here. I wanna tell you, if I got anybody that's like-minded, that woman right there, we are peanut butter and jelly. We are peas and carrots, y'all understand? But let me, peas and ochre, yes, that's right. I'm an ochre. But what I wanna say this is that she is an elder, a pastor, and if I'm not around, she represents me, period. Now we've had elders and elders are gone now. We plan on getting back to ordaining some elders and some people I need to talk to. And I've talked to some that have, don't wanna step into that, because I can't do that, all right? But what I'm saying is right now, she is an elder. And Kelsey, even though she is hired by the church to run the media, to run the ministry school, and that she's on staff and she gets paid, but she is still our delegated authority. If it's not me and my wife, then it's Kelsey. And Kelsey, I would say, operates in what we would call like a deacon, like one of those, like Phoebe, like she is a servant. She would do this for us if she didn't get paid. She might have to do something else, but she would do, because she likes us, right? But I've had to let people know, I mean, we've had students, I'm like, she represents me. If she sends you an email or a text or tries to call you and you don't answer her, I get offended, because I see it as disrespectful. And then I have to get involved. I just told the students on the Monday, last Monday night orientation, coming in,
one of my pet peeves, if my wife reaches out to you or Kelsey and you don't answer a text or an email or a phone call, I'm gonna hear about it and my blood pressure's gonna start rising. But see, that's the way God feels about his delegated authority. When he delegates authority to somebody and you attack it or disobey it or offend it, it is doing it to him. That's the way he looks at it. Watchman, he goes on to talk about this in the book, but I wanna show you this. Let's just go to the next one. We'll go to some of the other quotes from this book in a second, but let's read the scriptures on this. Here's the scriptures. Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder, yea, all of you be subject one to another. Now what that means about being subject, not that we do away with order, but we're willing to listen. Look, I'm willing to listen to you. What does he say there in Timothy? Rebuke not an elder, but entreat him as a father, meaning you better come with a humble attitude to talk. Not to correct, not to rebuke. You are not here to correct me, to rebuke me, or to teach me. You understand? If that's what you think you're going to do, you best be finding another church, all right? But I'm open to talk about things, but if I perceive that it's with an attitude, it is probably not gonna go well, all right? And that's what this is talking about. Be clothed with humility. What is humility? Humility is always putting yourself lower than in your own estimation. We all have this own estimation of what we are, who we are. It's that whole thing about when you go, like Jesus said, when you go to a feast, don't go take the chief seats. He said, go to the back row, and if they call you up to where the place of honor, then you receive honor. But if they have to be told to go back and sit down, then you get dishonored. You get humbled and you get embarrassed a little bit, right? And that's what we do. We may deserve to be in the honorable seats, but then, but you go, but I'm not sitting up there. You know what I'm saying? I'm gonna go sit in the back. I can't tell you how many campaign events where I'm supposed to be the speaker, like the chief speaker. You know where I went to go sit down? Back row. Wait till they call me up front. Not up there looking like a peacock, like a turkey. Who, look at me. And everybody, you know what? Everybody can smell that attitude anyway. But we need some of them politicians, man. It was like a TV camera.
You know, they're running to get in front of it. And I'm just like, if they wanna interview me, they'll interview me. I'm not running after the TV camera, right? And part of that, again, is being at peace and confident with who you are and letting God exalt you and not exalting yourself, right? And if we can do that, and part of that, again, is respecting authority. And if you can do that, that's part of that humbling process. But let's go to the next one. These verses, man, people don't like to hear this. Let's go on to the next one. And talk about knowledge, we'll create pride. And I've talked about that before. Let's go to the next one. All right, this is, yeah, this is the quote right here. Now, the Art of War, great old, old book by some Chinese general. Many people read this for different reasons, but it's about the strategy of all warfare. And within this, he says, equally guilty are those who advance against orders and those who retreat against orders. He said, Tu Mu tells a story in connection with Wu Chi, or whatever his name is, when he was fighting against the Qian State, he said, before the battle had begun, one of his soldiers, a man matchless, daring, sallied forth by himself, captured two heads from the enemy and returned to camp. Wu Chi had the man instantly executed, whereupon an officer ventured to demonstrate, say, this man was a good soldier and not not to been beheaded. And Wu Chi replied, I fully believe he was a good soldier, but I had him beheaded because he acted without orders. See, this is the way a military is. Now, granted, we have our orders. We have orders in this book. But there are things not in this book. There's nowhere where it says, hey, you, jackleg, don't lay hands on people. There's no jackleg in here. But if I said, you see, what I'm saying, I have to say, hey, jackleg, don't lay hands on people. Right? Well, guess what? That is an order. And if it's not respected and obeyed, we gonna have a problem. Now let's keep going. Yeah, well, that's it. Now I'm looking for the one back up to, well, Hebrews, and I quoted this a few, Hebrews 10, 17, let's go to that. Yeah, that's, I mean, that's good. That's about two, you know, there's the old saying, you can't lead where you won't go and you can't teach what you don't know. Anything, too, that I teach you, anything that I tell you to do, fast, pray, witness, preach, go to the street, talk to your, anything that I preach and teach, I've done it or will do it.
I have no, I don't teach what I don't know and I don't teach what I haven't done or what I haven't experienced. I don't believe you should do that. Hebrews 13, 17 was obey them that have the rule over you. Now see, this makes so many Christians cringe. It makes them cringe, but it says obey them that have the rule over you and submit yourselves for they watch for your souls as they that must give an account that they may do it with joy and not with grief for that is unprofitable for you. So let me tell you, just this one situation that I just had to deal with, it has been a year of me having to think about it, pray about it, ask God for wisdom, how to approach it, how to deal with it, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's caused me a lot of grief that I didn't need. Had somebody just obeyed from the beginning, we wouldn't have this problem. And this is what, again, you start talking like this, is this Bible, let me say, is this Bible? So when he says obey, those that have the rule over, that means somebody's got the rule over you when it comes to Christianity, to church, government, and organization, right? Unless you're gonna roam the streets. So this is not, they expected this. And you know what's interesting is that Eastern, Middle Eastern people and your Asian culture, they get this. I mean, even now, the Asian culture understands you respect elders. You respect those that are in authority. And far more than, say, Americans do. Or, you know, the West, we'll just say. But this is a principle, this is a biblical principle. And, you know, there's been times I've had to tell people, and this is something I try to, you know, this is something I tell my children sometimes. Over the years, I've told my children. When I tell you something, your job as my child is to obey it. You don't have to understand why. You don't have to know, even if I'm stern with you, you don't have to know why I'm stern. You don't have to know, you don't have to know why you just obey. And this is the way the Lord wants us to be. It's like too many times we got, why? There's a lot of little kids, why, why, why? You know, here's another, parents, you understand this, because parents are not, what, you're busy, right? Y'all know that y'all raised some kids. You're busy. You just need them to go do what they're supposed to do, right? Get out of my hair, right?
Go do what you're supposed to do so I can do this, right? Man, why, why, why, why? Oh, and let me tell you something about men, women and children. If a man who understands his authority says, I need you to do this, okay? And you keep questioning, or you complain, or you don't go do it. Let me tell you what that equates to him, is you don't respect him and you don't love him, period. Talk is cheap. And it's just five after 12, so we got a little while. But talk is cheap. This is why God said, you love me? What? Obey me. This is what's deep in the heart of a man. If you respect me and you love me, then you would respect the words that come out of my mouth. I wouldn't have to repeat myself. I wouldn't have to fuss. I wouldn't have to scream. I wouldn't have to get mad. Just respect what I say. And this is the way God is, and this is the way authorities are. Teachers, look, I've taught high schoolers and junior high schoolers. I've taught classes of students. I'm like, just do what I just told you to do and quit running your mouth, right? There's a reason you're doing what you need to do. You're gonna learn what you need to learn. If you do it the way I tell you to do it, quit. Now, I gotta do this, I don't wanna do this. But the same goes in church, see? Think about this, how much, you whine and complain enough on a job, about the job you're told to do, and let me tell you what words you're gonna hear. You're fired, right? And what do we do? Here's what's amazing. To make sure we don't get fired and keep a paycheck, what do we do? We keep that mouth shut, don't we? Mm, right? Even with things that might be needed to be said or corrected or fixed, but you're not the boss and it's not your job to fix it. Keep your mouth, what? And people do that for a paycheck, but they can come into church and just say whatever they want. What's a free country? I can do whatever I want, I can say, really? Well, there's consequences. Yeah, you can go to work and say whatever you want, but there could be consequences, right? I learned that one of my first jobs, I was working at Food World Grocery Store. I was the do everything guy, right? Bad groceries, unload the truck, stock the shells. I did everything in the grocery store. Cashier, I did it all. Well, one of my friends worked there. We were in high school, a bunch of idiots.
And he got into this thing where basically it was a battle between him and another cashier and some money went missing. And he was saying it was her, she was saying it's him. And I wasn't even supposed to be in it. And I said something. And the manager of the store walked over to me and said, you're fired. He fired me, because I opened my mouth. And I was like, and let me tell you, I don't care how much of a smart aleck kid you think you are, it kind of stings to get fired. When you did something wrong, I mean like when you just get, ugh, he's right. What the heck was I doing? Why did I get in that drama? Why did I say anything? Because I didn't respect, see, I was 16, not saved, drinking and partying, all that. I didn't respect authority. And I found out, right? And I kind of needed that job. Bye-bye, you're out. Had to explain to my mom why I got fired. That was more humiliation. This is, this is a serious issue. And remember, if you have a true five-fold minister, apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, and teacher, if you have that, they are doing, if they're truly following Jesus, now I know not all of them are, but if they're truly following Jesus, you have one that's sincere, that's trying to obey the Lord and do what's right. They are, what they're doing is trying to look out for you. They're trying to teach you what you need to know. They're trying to protect you from the wolves. They're trying to protect you from people that are gonna hurt you and all kinds of stuff. So there's a point where you have to decide, do I trust this leadership or I don't? If you do, then trust it until proven otherwise. But if you can't, then you gotta go find leadership that you can trust. Because let me just go on and tell you this. Everyone needs leadership in your life. Everyone needs it. We're not supposed to be. This is just the way God said it. And I had people all the time tell me, I'm not doing this and I'm not doing that. I'm my own person, just me and the Holy Spirit. I'm like, well, wait a minute. Do you obey the speed limit? Do you have a driver's license? Oh, you do, huh? So you're submitting to that, but you don't wanna hear from a preacher, a pastor, a church. Oh, but you'll see, you'll submit the things because of the benefit, right?
And that's okay. There's things I believe the Bible says that we're to submit to government until the government goes completely evil and tells us to do things contrary to the scriptures. And then we get to a point where we must obey God rather than men. And that's what I'm saying. If ever leadership, whether it be in church, school, government, everything, if it becomes evil and it's trying to lead you into evil and into deception and error and immorality, then yes, you are to say no to that leadership and move away from it or resist it openly. I agree. But over petty things, over little opinions or disagreements about little things, no. We are to be a people that are respectful and humble and submissive, especially when it comes to authority. I wanna show you this. Put up the, this the first two, watch movie. We'll put up the first one, just the one and two. This is in the beginning of the book and he makes this point and it's always stuck with me. It's a God's throne is established on authority. And he says here, the acts of God issue from his throne and his throne is established on his authority. All things are created through God's authority and all physical laws of the universe are maintained by his authority. Hence the Bible expresses it as holding all things by the word of his power. Now the word power in Greek can be either dunamis or exutia, right? Exutia means authority. Dunamis is power. I'll give you the example of that. The policeman's badge is exutia. That represents he has the authority delegated to him to act in a certain way to enforce the law. The gun he carries on his side is the dunamis. It is the power to back up the authority if it's resisted to a point where it has to be dealt with. And this is what he's saying. God says he holds all thing by the power of his authority for God's authority represents God himself. Whereas his power stands only for his act. Do you understand that, what he's saying? His power is what he does. His authority is part of his nature, who he is. So when you sin against his nature, you're sinning against him. See, we forget that Lucifer's fall, Lucifer, Satan's rebellion was about authority. It wasn't about the lust of the flesh. It wasn't about some vice. He wanted authority that was not his. And that's what he goes on to say. He says, sin against power is more easily forgiven than sin against authority. Because the latter is a sin against God himself. God alone is authority in all things. All authorities of the earth are instituted by God. Authority is a tremendous thing in the universe. Nothing overshadows it. It is therefore imperative for us who desire to serve God
to know the authority of God. Now let's go to the next one. He says, in serving God, we must not violate authorities. Because to do so is the principle of Satan. He said, how can we preach Christ according to Satan's principle? He says, yet it is possible in our work to stand with Christ in doctrine while at the same time stand with Satan in principle. Let's just pause on that for a second. You may have all your doctrine correct, but if you can't submit to a delegated authority, you are operating in the spirit of Satan. You understand? This is why rebellion, so you can be correct, but be in rebellion to authority. You understand, right? For instance, I don't like to drive 55. I'm like Sammy Hagar, right? Y'all don't even know what that is, right? But guess what? I fudged a little bit, like my wife from Atlanta. Fudged a little bit. But let me tell you what happens when you see that state trooper down the road piece. You slow down to 55, don't you? Uh-huh. The law, the authority. Mm, it's tightened up, right? It's all about this. It's all about recognizing. That's what we feel, right? When you see that state trooper and you're going, you know, you're going 75 and a 55 and you see the state trooper, what do you do? Right? That's because you're clashing with authority, all right? But I love this. He said, it is possible in our work to stand with Christ in doctrine while at the same time stand with Satan in principle. How very wicked for us to assume that we are doing the work of the Lord. Please take note that Satan is not afraid of our preaching the word of Christ yet how very much he is in fear of us being subject to the authority of Christ. Never should we who serve God serve according to the principle of Satan. Whenever the principle according to Christ is operating, that of Satan fades away. Satan is the usurper today. He will be cast down at the time of the end of the book of Revelation. If we would truly serve God, we must completely be completely purified from the principle of Satan. And that is rebellion. Now granted, our first submission is to Jesus, to the word of God. But then God delegates authorities and they are to be respected. Remember what he said to the disciples? He said, those who hear you are hearing me, right? Those who reject you are rejecting me. God always has representatives.
Like, look, we have ambassadors in other countries everywhere. Let me tell you, if I'm president of the United States and I get a phone call from an ambassador in wherever, I won't hurt a country's feelings. And they tell me, the president of this country and his people are mistreating me, they're abusing me, they're attacking our embassy. Guess what that is? That's not just an attack on that person. That is an attack upon me. It is an attack upon the country because they represent me. See, that's what was so bad about years ago, the Benghazi thing. It's because they were getting attacked and oh, Hillary just let everybody die because they wanted to cover up their crimes. No, if you love them and you look to go, they represent me, if I'd have been president and I got a call from the Benghazi embassy, guess what would have happened? It would have been unleashed it upon Libya. I would have rescued them and I would have destroyed that attack. I don't care if I had to send an entire fleet. You understand, why? Because it was an attack not just on that embassy and that ambassador, but upon me as president, upon my country. And this is the way it is with the Lord. It is very serious that we respect his delegated authorities as well as his authority. There's a lot of people that all respect the Lord, but I don't want anybody over me. Well, I'm sorry, but that's not the way the church works. It's not the way the kingdom works. Now, let's, I will skip that. I think I sent you a bunch of them, but we'll just skip that because it's getting late. Now, Cheetra, if you wanna come up, I'm gonna let her share this. This is how we know, sometimes we overlook things. And like I shared over the past, sometimes I should deal with things that I don't deal with. This person that I had to deal with, anybody that's been here at church long enough, you know who I'm talking about, so I'm not naming names because I've dealt with that problem now. But I want you to realize this is what happened when this person laid hands on Cheetra at Skyfall with saying she knew she wasn't supposed to, right? Had I seen it, we would have had a problem then. Had Cheetra told me earlier, would have dealt with it then. And see, this is another thing. Don't be afraid to be the house of Chloe, tattled. And she did this twice to Cheetra at Skyfall, this person did, who had this spirit of divination upon them from their stuff.
I'm gonna let her tell. So thank you, Pastor Dean. I should, we should not have been here today. Craig and I actually came to the church and returned because we were both feeling very sick. We actually went back and I texted Pastor Nancy, I cannot come today because we are sick. She called me, then we decided to come and now I realize I'm not as sick as I thought I was. So I'm glad I'm here. But before, so in Skyfall, I was here all the time. So Pastor Dean had specifically told only people with bad should be praying. And I knew that. So on the day, just before I had a talk and just before that, I was very nervous. Usually I don't get nervous, but I was nervous. And this person, we were sitting just behind Pastor Dean. In the front row was Pastor Dean, I was just behind him. So she just laid hands on me and said, I know we are not supposed to pray, but I know you are nervous. We are coming from the same church, so it should be okay and just laid hands and prayed. And the thing is, I'm not telling it's their fault, it's my fault. So for me, when I came last year, I came and told it later, much later, in October or something, I told them. I was more worried about me because I realized if I have a transferred spirit, unless I go and repent, I cannot make getting out of those spirits. And I am not, I failed spiritual warfare last year and I was telling Craig, this is the only course I have ever failed in my life. So spiritual warfare was not something I ever understood, and I had to take it again this past spring to graduate. So I always struggled because from India, I have heard a lot about spiritual warfare, but I always thought it's a myth and superstitions. So when, and then later that evening, I was, the same person came to me and told, she saw a witch laying hands on me, touching me. I didn't, by the way. And because of that, she will pray for me. And she just prayed for the witch. And I, and even told me that after that, she went and talked to Pastor Dean and told that this witch is touching me and Pastor Dean has asked to just make sure that always watch me or something like that. And we did talk about that person also. And so for me, that was it. I later, I was supposed to write a letter of recommendation for this person for the ministry school. I had some other reasons that I was always kind of talking to them, but at the same time, I loved spiritual authority course, the first course that Pastor Dean was talking about. I'm a very rebellious person. Everyone who knows me knows that, some are laughing. I'm very rebellious from childhood, like two years, three years, I'm rebellious. So for me, that course kind of changed me.
So sometimes I even used to get angry with Kelsey, but because of spiritual authority, I suddenly realized I should not be. And that helped me so much. And that's the first time in my life I learned to submit to three people. And now, of course, to my husband little by little. But the thing is, so yeah, I'm working on it. So, but the, so later, so I talked about some other thing. And Pastor Nancy was kind enough. I said, I believe that if this person takes the course and learns spiritual authority, she might fully change. So that was my thing. But at that point, I never thought, I had never even thought about this laying hands. I forgot about it. It was other things I talked about. Then October or something, I called Pastor, like something we were discussing and I told this happened. And then Pastor Dean called and like, why did he not tell me? I'm like, I'm so sorry. I didn't think like that because we are from the same church. But I knew in my heart, it was wrong what I did. And it was not about the person. For me, it was about me. Like I knew what I did was wrong. It was, you know, it's about me. I'm not a child. So I should have said no. So that was my issue. And we talked about it. And after that, you see that person was here till now. So it is last October. And last Saturday, I was talking to Craig. Craig is all about deliverance. And now I'm learning more and more about it. And we have been praying too. So Pastor Nancy texted me because I told her something about a blue light a couple of weeks back. And she asked me, have you, like, do you have someone laid hands on you? Do you know about Kundalini? And Kundalini is not a spirit I ever liked. Because in India, my cousins and all used to do yoga and many spiritual things to make it activate. And I never was interested in it. And Pastor Dean did pray about that in my deliverance. And nothing happened. But that day when Pastor Nancy asked Craig, and I just, for simply, he just put hands on me and started paying for Kundalini. And he said, I went like a snake for a second, like 10 seconds or something. And I have no remembrance. And then I ran to the, and puked. And then again, that happened Saturday, yesterday morning. We were sitting. And I just was explaining to Craig because I texted Pastor Nancy in the morning. Like, I know Pastor Dean didn't mention my name in the text. But I am very worried about this church, people walking out of the church because of what happened. So I really wanted unity. So I said, you can name me. I don't mind talking. I was talking, telling about the Wednesday group. I just wanted to tell the close members who come to church, this was a real incident. And I was responsible. So I just wanted to tell that. So then I just wanted to explain to Craig that I knew Wednesday I might have to talk. So I said, Craig, like this happened that day. And when the witch part happened, the second time she prayed, when she laid hands on me,
I said, oh, my hand even feels numb and kind of tingly. And he suddenly was like, you felt numb and tingly when she laid hands and prayed. And he started praying over me again. And I really puked when he said, initially he was just praying in tongue. I'm just sitting there like nothing happening, a little cuff here and there. When he said the spirit of divination, I just, and now I'm even, yeah, transfer spirit of divination. And I just went out, I puked, and I'm like, okay, something lifted off me. And I know this is because of the rebellion too. So, yeah. And see, this is why we say, and she didn't tell the part, she said it was some huge black blob. Now I've seen this happen before. This is why we tell y'all these kind of things. Somebody, you let a person lay hands on you that you're not supposed to let lay hands on you and they can transfer anything. And sometimes even slip around and do it behind your back. Okay. And this is why too, you've got to pay attention and the Lord reveal things. It's just like, cause she started praying, and she was praying with my wife one day and started talking about, when she was praying, she'd see a blue light. Well, I know from dealing with New Agers and witches and people coming out of Hinduism and all that stuff, that the blue light, blue flame, whatever, that's part of the Kundalini and those divination spirits that you pick up from that. So when she said that, we're like, okay. Now she'd already been through deliverance. So something happened from her deliverance, right? Her initial deliverance. And so it was the laying on of hands of this person who has a spirit of divination upon them from the stuff that they do. And let me just go ahead and tell y'all right now. And see, I said this early on, and I'm just going to be very straightforward. When I heard about the little blood analysis stuff, like taking a little, some of your blood and using that to find out, figure out what's wrong with you by looking at how it looks, I said, that's divination. I said it from the get-go, right? I told her, don't be doing that in this church. I said, if you do these things, we're going to have a problem. I said this from the beginning, we're going to have a problem, right? So start swearing, I'm not going to do these things. And guess what? I found out it was going on behind my back anyway. So what is that? That is rebellion and divination and laying on of hands to transfer things. Now, with Chitra's situation, that devil has worked real hard to try to kill her because she has quite the testimony. So what I'm saying is, is that this thing could make her seriously sick and have some serious spiritual and physical problems. This is why we've warned you guys about, I've got the whole series out there, a cursed objects in your house, the transference of spirits by just who you hang around. You know, the Bible is very clear about if you just hang around the wrong people, it will affect you, all right? This is why sometimes there's relationships you have to cut off.
And again, it's about being spirit-led. It's about, again, being a person of prayer and fasting and being in the Word. But also, if you will listen to people who are, the Bible says in the multitude of counselors, what, there is safety with good advice, make your war. So the Lord's gonna use others to help protect you or bring to your attention some of these things and you have to be willing to listen. And that's what I'm talking about. It's like, okay, the blue light thing. A lot of people don't know that. And what's funny is after that happened, with the blue light situation, and then we realize, you know, it's a spirit of divination, then we figure out where we know where it came from, who it came from. I get a message in Facebook Messenger from a lady says, hey, what about this blue light? People are talking about seeing this blue light. So I'm like, isn't that weird? And I just explained to her, we just dealt with this, a situation with this blue light, it's divination, Kundalini, new age demons, you need to cast them out. It's not, the Lord doesn't appear that way. He doesn't appear in blue light, orange light. The Lord is glorious light. I mean, he's just different. And when he manifests, you feel his presence and his power and on down the line. But if you start seeing lights and orbs and auras, and you got to open door somewhere. And this is why deliverance is such an important issue. But again, if Chitra hadn't listened to Pastor Nancy, listen to what I said, listen to her husband, she wanted to be rebellious, she still have those demons. And listen, the demons are there to cause you serious problems. They're not trying to get in just to hang out. They're getting in to have some serious, cause you some serious problems. And so this is something that again, I think if you haven't dealt with the area of deliverance thoroughly, it's something you need to deal with thoroughly. And if that person has laid hands on you, prayed for you, or you've gone to one of the blood divination, I would definitely start praying over that issue, binding the demons that came in through the laying on of hands, really a blood ritual, divination, familiar spirits, witchcraft spirit, I would be binding those demons that came in through that person and command them to leave. And they're probably watching this morning, and I don't care. This is what's been going on. And it's funny, but once I dealt with the problem and put it out there, then I had more people come and tell me, oh yeah, she's doing this behind your back. And let me just go and tell you, if you wanna see me get like the throw tables over Jesus, that Jesus, that's when I get that way. Because you know what, I can handle all kinds of stuff.
I'm patient, my wife will tell you. She said, you are patient. I was patient with this situation. And again, a lot of it I didn't know was going on behind my back. But again, when I find that out, I can feel that the Lord's, his upset about this violation of authority thing and basically trying to pollute the church body behind my back. And this is, it just really, really irks me. And you wanna talk about the quick wrath coming down upon you. You can be struggling, I mean, you might be struggling with pornography. You might be struggling with lust. You might be struggling with anger. I'll be patient with you and try to help you as much as I can. But you start down the rebellion road and it's not gonna last very long. And why? See, there's a difference. Once you start sitting against authority, it's a whole different realm. And it usually starts manifesting just different little ways of disrespect. That's why I love some Hispanic and women. Because boy, let me tell you, I've seen some Hispanic mothers, children say something, back hand is coming, and I love it. Don't you ever talk to me like that. You better not ever. I remember one of our friends from Bolivia back in the day, she told a story about her mom from Bolivia, she was a teenager and her mom was talking to her about something and she's sitting in the car and she goes, whatever, to her mother. Her mother had rings on them fingers. Cross the mouth, don't you ever. And see, a lot of people, oh, that's abuse. No, it's not. That's a violation of authority and quick punishment. You understand? I mean, because we're not against spanking and we're not against punishment. Punishment is children should get a spanking. I know the world, like I say, oh, don't spank the child, but spare the rod, spoil the child, right? And let me tell you something. Our friend from Bolivia, she never did it again to her mother. He never talked back to that woman again. Not ever again, right? But see, again, it's about respect. She knew immediately the reason she got that reaction because it wasn't just words, it was an attack on authority. And mama just, something in her deal with, oh, no, you didn't. You're not doing that. And my mom was the same way.
Boy, I tell you what, my mom would pick up anything she could find and deal with us. I remember mouthing off to my mom one time and she picked up my BB gun and broke it over my arm. I'm like, that woman's serious. But you know, boys tend to test their mothers. Shouldn't do it. Honor, respect, and obey those in authority and your life will be longer and more peaceable, right? All right, let's stand. Thank you, Lord. Father, we just come to you today. Father, all we wanna do as Christians is do things your way. What's your word, the way your word says to do it and the way your Holy Spirit leads us and I'd help us all to receive that, to be humble, to be submitted to your authority and your delegated authority, to understand how church is supposed to operate, how to be in unity as a church body. Because, Lord, we want your anointing and your glory to float. It's like you said, how good and pleasant it is and for brethren to dwell together in unity. It is like that oil, that anointing that comes down upon Aaron, a man you put in authority and then it flows down to everyone else and, Lord, that is the way you do things and we want your presence and we want your anointing and we wanna do things the right way and we want you to help us, Lord, to be humble and not rebellious or defiant or just stubborn, Lord, because we know, God, that that is, rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft and we don't wanna be opening the door to that. So I pray you help us discern it when it starts rising up in us and that you will grant us the grace and to initiate self-control because you've called us to be a people who can control ourselves and control our mouths and our attitudes and repent before it ever comes out of our mouth. Lord, I pray you help us with that so we can be a church that is moving into the unity of the faith and I pray that for Fire and Grace Church. I pray that for other churches out there as well that are trying to do it the right way, the best they can, that there would be a group in that church that the majority would come into unity in agreement, speak the same thing, have the same mind, the same judgment, respect those in authority, even if there's little disagreements
about inconsequential things and help us all, Lord, be clothed with humility and be able to receive correction. I pray that in Jesus' name. Amen, amen. All right, well, did y'all learn something today? All right, last week too. And let me just share something else with y'all real quick. You know, Pastor Troy and Pastor D are here and they are pastors and they are elders in the kingdom of God. And, you know, when something goes down in this church even though they have their church in Montgomery but they come here, but I let them know we communicate as to what's going on because some of our folks go over there and some of their folks come over here and we fellowship back and forth as two churches. And so don't ever think that we don't let them know what's going on, like you're gonna slip to Montgomery and do something. And it's been tried. It's been tried, but it didn't work. Why? Because they're in unity, right? And I respect them as elders in the church and they respect me the same way and we're not gonna play with this foolishness, you know? And so, but that's how we stay in unity. There has to be in any situation, there has to be leadership. It's just, somebody contacted me the other day and there was a question about that. I said, everything rises or falls on leadership. I mean, either you have bad leadership or good leadership or no leadership. And it's just part of the human experience that we have to learn how to find it and submit to it and be humble. And now in this Google everything age, everybody thinks they know everything or they can find it out in five seconds. And like I've said before, getting a piece of information is not the same as experience, right? All right. Well, y'all know the drill. Hugs up next before you leave, Skyfall. We have secured the Callaway Conference Center again in the Grange, Georgia. So go to SkyfallConference.org. You can begin to register. Look, hey, we're gonna have good bathrooms and in air conditioning. So that's nice. They blessed us. We paid for Friday, Saturday and Sunday. And then we decided, well, we might need Thursday and she called them back. Nancy did call them back. And they gave us Thursday for like 800 bucks. And now let me tell you, it's not normally 800 bucks for a day. So we, yeah, on Thursday, we'll be setting up and then doing the hangout there from four to six instead of going somewhere else for a picnic and all.
You just got to be running back and forth between that was too much. Cause it's gonna take us a little while to set up everything there. So we'll have plenty of time Thursday. Probably can do some pre-registration and stuff like that. And yes, yes, yeah. Yeah, that'll be, we're trying to figure out, I think my wife's trying to figure out how to do that. Yeah. I hope it's what I think it's gonna be. Cause that's good. It's good stuff. Hoping, praying. I'm not even gonna say it cause in case it doesn't happen. All right. But anyway, that is what I'm saying. We signed the contract. We've got the place. It's done. All right. Anybody out there that was worrying about that before registering or making your flights or your hotel plans, you can go ahead and do that now. So, all right. Well, talk some next before you leave. All right.